If She Tells You That She’s Messed Up, Believe Her

Why you should believe women who tell you they are messed up and not good to date.

In this video coaching newsletter, I discuss an email from a 40-year-old viewer who says he’s been following my work for about three years now. At his previous job, he started hooking up with a hot co-worker who is 22 and working on her master’s degree. She told him he wasn’t her type, but they kept seeing each other for about four months. Then he abruptly quit his job and she said the job wouldn’t be as much fun without him. She ghosted him shortly afterwards.

He reached out after 30 days of no contact and she apologized for ghosting him and said she was messed up. He expects to hear form her again, but he’s unsure what to do next. My comments are in bold italics like this below in the body of his email.

Well, as the late, great Maya Angelou said, “When somebody tells you who they are or they show you who they are, you should believe them the first time.” So this particular email is from a guy who is 40 and he’s been following my work for about three years, he says. At a previous job of his he started working, or I should say, he started working with and then hooking up with a girl who’s 22 and working on her master’s degree. Initially she’s like, “Well, you’re not really my type,” but they kept seeing each other for about four months. Then one day he woke up, he’s like, “You know, the boss I work for is an asshole. They’re toxic,” and he just quit. Then when she found out, she’s like, “Well, I’m really going to miss you. It’s not going to be as much fun without you.” Then shortly after that, she just completely ghosted him. He’s like, “What the hell?” Then he waited about 30 days and then reached out again. He’s kind of like, “Hey, what happened?” She apologized. She said it was rude and really cruel and they talked, but she ended up saying, “I’m really messed up. I’m dysfunctional,” then tells him she was abused and she’s got all these problems.

The idea is that you, as a man, want a relationship, what you should focus on is getting to a happy place first. Build a great life and a great lifestyle for yourself, a lifestyle and a social life that you’re proud of and that you’re happy with that brings you great joy and makes you happy and most importantly, makes you smile a lot. When you get to a happy place, then you can find somebody else who’s also in a happy place, and they’ve done whatever work they need to do on themselves to be somebody that is happy, whole, complete, ready, willing, able and open to dating you so you can share your completeness, not show up and be two broken people that are trying to fix themselves. If they get together, then being with that other person is what’s going to make them happy, so you got to get to a happy place first, and then you can share your happiness and share your completeness with one another, because you can’t give away what you don’t already have for yourself.

So with that in mind, let’s go through his email because even though they talked, it didn’t really go anywhere. Afterwards he was just like, “Ah, I wasn’t expecting to hear that.” I wrote about something similar in my book, like one of my girlfriends from many, many years ago when we were out on a date, I think it was our first date or our second date, I can’t remember. This is our second date, actually. She said, “I fuck all my relationships up.” I could see her face, her beautiful, gorgeous face, her beautiful green eyes looking at me and saying that, but I was like, “This girl is so perfect. This is a dream girl. It’s love at first sight.” I just heard that and I’m like, “I can work with this. No big deal. I’m not worried about that a bit. This is going to be amazing.” Sure enough, she was very difficult at times. She messed things up. She displayed a lot of passive aggressive type of behavior.

When women tell you that they’re fruit loops or they’re screwballs, you should believe in the first time, because this guy is scratching his head going like, “I don’t understand what happened. Doesn’t make any sense to me.” Then again, keep in mind she’s 22 and he initially was like, “Wow, she’s really mature for her age,” but her behavior and then saying how messed up she is, you’re 40 years old. You don’t really want to deal with that. Ideally, maybe this girl would be great when she’s 25, 27 years old. Maybe she could use some therapy, does some work on herself and really gets to a good, happy place because she doesn’t sound like she’s in a good, happy place. If you are and you’re trying to have a relationship with a broken person, it’s not going to be easy and effortless. I mean, this guy thought things were sailing along fine, and all he does is leave his job. Then now all of a sudden, she just ghosts him completely. You would think after four months, if he’s been following me this long, that she wouldn’t just disappear like that. So maybe he misread the situation, or we really should just take her at her word when she says she’s really messed up because she goes into detail. We’ll get to that later as we go through the email.

Viewer’s Email:

Dear Coach,

I have been following your work for around three years now. I have read your book around three times now and I have the audio version four times and into my seventh read. In between this, I had an opportunity for a relationship with a much younger co-worker who jointed my company. I was in a slightly superior role and helped show her the ropes. We became friends pretty fast and I was always professional but included a little under the radar flirty playful presence with her and we clicked and just really got along.

You know what’s interesting? I think one of the the biggest places where people meet is at work, which is pretty fascinating when people are like, “Hey, how did you guys meet? “Couples that got together, work is like top five, but it’s the Me Too era, and you got to be careful. You got to be tactful. Let’s see how this guy handled that, because he’s kind of her boss.

She is much younger than me, I am 40 and she is 22.

There’s obviously chemistry. So like, how did he make the transition from being her boss to dating her?

She was studying for a master’s degree at university (College) and so was very intelligent and seemingly very mature for her age, as well as naturally very beautiful. I was flattered and even our a co-workers suggested to us both that we would make a great couple. I look good for my age, work out and keep myself youthful in my personality dress style and generally look after myself.

So here’s a key piece of evidence as to why she disappeared almost as quickly as she came into his life. So when they met, she was in a relationship.

She was just about to break up with her boyfriend and the night after she did I messaged her on WhatsApp suggesting we go for a drink.

It’s like, damn, he didn’t waste any time. So that’s pretty bold to do something like that, because if it’s misinterpreted, again, it depends on the context of their interactions, but it seems like there was a lot of interactions, and she was probably giving him indicators of interest, playing with her hair, touching his arm, laughing at all his jokes. Maybe she was reaching out to him and texted him outside business hours. I mean, they are on WhatsApp. It’s not texting. So he said, “Hey, let’s go have a drink.” She just broke up with somebody, so she’s definitely on the rebound. That’s a very fortuitous time to slide in there. Like I said, I don’t know the context of their conversations, but it worked out in his favor. That’s pretty bold to do it that way.

Typically, what I would do it in these situations is, if you’re working in a normal corporate type thing, you invite her to join you or you go out as a group with other people from work, or if you’re chatting and you’re like, “Hey, what are you doing this weekend?” Then she tells you, “Oh, I’m going out with my girlfriends. We’re going to this place.” “Oh, yeah? Well, my friends and I, we’re going to be down the street at this other venue. Maybe we can all meet up here, take my number, and when you guys are down there, shoot us a text and let us know where you are. Maybe we all meet up together, hang out or have a drink together, that’d be fun.” If the girl likes you, she’s like, “Yeah,” and she’ll take the number. If she doesn’t, she’ll say, “Oh yeah, I’ll do that,” and then she’ll never ask you for the number. So it’s just a very low risk way to do it, but I don’t know how their numbers were exchanged, but there was a lot of chit chatting and talking and she had a boyfriend. You see how quickly he slid in there? I mean, literally the day after the breakup happened, he’s like, “Hey, let’s meet for a drink.”

She agreed and we went out to several places for drinks. I never told her exactly where we where going and because we knew each other she let me pick her up and went along with me.

Well, she obviously felt safe with you. So enough rapport had been created at work and through whatever their interactions over text or WhatsApp had been. So obviously, she was letting him know about her romantic situation, so they probably broached the subject.

At the third bar and us having a great time, I went in for a kiss and she loved it but acted super surprised. “Wow I didn’t expect that,” she said. I smiled at her and said, “Of course you did, but did you expect this?” And went in straight for another passionate kiss. We where in a small corner of the bar in a booth and no one could see us. By this time I could tell she was so into me so I suggested we head back to my place and open some wine.

Aha! That’s the trial close. You went to three different places. It’s like, three different dates. Remember she just had a breakup, she’s on the rebound. If she was the one that got dumped, she was feeling pretty shitty, women know that hey, if it doesn’t work out, just get on another horse. Literally.

Bedroom Olympics soon occurred and it was amazing. She said something like, “OK, let’s just agree this is a one time thing…”

In other words, “Don’t get too attached. I’m just a drifter. I’m just passing through.”

…Just before and I didn’t reply but I was certain this was a shit test.

Well, it’s just indicative of how she was feeling. She could probably tell that you were really digging her, probably a little more. She was digging you because remember, she just got broken up with. I don’t know if she did the dumping or not, he didn’t say. If she did get dumped, remember, rejection breeds obsession, and you made her feel good. It was a nice rebound, a nice evening of rebound sex to help her with her grief therapy. It was very gentlemanly of you.

She stayed over and the next day I drove her home a few blocks from where I live. She said in the car that I wasn’t her type and I just responded, “Oh well, I certainly must be magical because I was sooo your type last night,” and she giggled.

That’s a great comeback. You always want to have a better, more playful comeback, especially if she says something like, “Oh, you’re too old for me. You are so much older.” I was like, “Well, you didn’t seem to mind last night when you had your tongue down my throat, Little Miss Innocent.”

We kissed and I saw her into her house and drove home with the biggest smile on my face.

We dated around four months, I would see her once a week either on a date or have her come over for wine and movies, or to cook with me and we spent Christmas together (We first started dating on Halloween). Last month in March, I suddenly left the company we worked in as the place had gotten toxic and I only really hung about there because of this girl. She messaged me about being sad that I left and things won’t be as fun. I replied, then she ghosted me for weeks.

Remember, she just broke up with that guy. Now he’s out of the picture, so I don’t know how long she was with this other dude. If she was with the previous ex-boyfriend for a couple of years and then she literally goes from being in a relationship with him to the very next day you’re asking her out on a drink and then you’re hooking up with her like within two days, and now all of a sudden it’s like a relationship. So she took the intimacy she had with the other guy and, in essence, replaced her ex-boyfriend with you and didn’t take any time to heal. The fact that she just all of a sudden dipped tells me that she probably wasn’t as into this guy as he thought and she bounced back to the ex potentially, because that’s kind of what it looks like for her just to all of a sudden go cold like that, but there’s more.

I did no contact back to her for around 30 days then I just sent a little message that I hope she was doing well. I didn’t know what happened, but if she was upset I left the job without telling her then that wasn’t the case, I just woke up one day and thought, “I can’t go back the place and our boss is too toxic.” I ended with suggesting if she changes her mind in the future and wants to meet for a drink out somewhere anytime to let me know.

Well, you should be meeting out for drinks. If you’re following what’s in 7 Principles To Get An Ex Back, she should be coming to your place to make dinner in the evening together if she reaches out to you.

When a woman ghosts you, you don’t keep chasing after her. Number one, it’s rude. You spent four months together and she just stops replying to your texts for a month? I would have never reached back out to her. I mean, that’s extremely fucking rude. Again, you got to keep in mind, you jumped right into a relationship with her, in essence. It doesn’t sound like they were exclusive, but she was on the rebound. So women like that, they’re drifters, they’re just kind of passing through. Their emotions are going to be all over the place, so you’re not going to get normal, consistent behavior, typically with somebody that literally was with one guy and then two days later she’s sleeping with you, so that’s to be expected. It’s in the book, it warns you about that, but you know she’s hot, you’re willing to roll the dice. It’s like, whatever. Put your big boy pants on. It’s your life. Make your own decisions and make up your own mind about things. My goal as a coach is to help you get what you want, and then it’s up to you to decide if you still want it.

This isn’t what you teach but I took a calculated risk and didn’t care if she responded or not.

Oh, you cared. I mean, you took all this time to write this email. You cared.

I had a new job and was focusing on my life and meeting plenty of girls as I was working in a busy bar in the city.

She then replied (unghosted me) saying she was sorry, it was nothing to do with me.

“It’s not you, it’s me.”

She had been really depressed and isolated herself because some past sexual trauma resurfaced and she found it hard to speak to me or any men about.

Again, she just had the breakup. On top of that, she’s dealing with all these issues. So when you hear a girl go, “I’m a train wreck. I’m a mess,” your attitude should be like, “Hey, I’m here for you. You got your friends, your family, your therapist or whatever. When you feel ready, give me a call.” When you hear something like that that’s not like, “Oh, I can’t wait to see her again,” you should be like, “Oh, she’s not really in a good place.” Again, ready, willing, able and open to dating you and having a relationship, and she clearly is not in that place. Again, she never got a chance to go through a breakup, take time to heal. So now she’s kind of dealing with her grief or whatever. In addition to obviously some other things.

But she was so sorry I got caught up in that and admitted it was a cruel thing to do to me.

I replied the next afternoon that I understand and that I hope she is getting support with her problems and that she has family and female friends she can talk to. I let her know that I care for her, and been super busy working late at a new job but if she wants to talk anytime, I am here. 

Again, when she’s like, “I’m a mess. I’m really screwed up,” maybe when I was younger, I’d have been like, “Hey, I can work with this.” As I got older, you hear those things and you see those patterns, when a girl tells you she’s messed up, especially trying to get into a relationship with a girl that was literally 24 hours before with some other guy, and now 24 hours later, she’s sleeping with you? She’s on the rebound. You can’t expect possibly that it’s just going to go smoothly, easily and effortlessly. Most normal women, when they have a breakup from a major relationship, they’re going to take months, maybe sometimes a year or so before they’re ready to start dating again, and they’re very selective.

Again, her high interest might have just been because literally within 24 hours, you were asking her on a date as soon as you found out she was single. You didn’t wait, but that’s the downside risk with dating women like this, is that they’re all over the ice, hot and cold. On top of that, this particular woman is kind of a mess.

It’s been 24 hours and I half expect she may reach out in a week or so, but I also can’t get it off my mind this is maybe an excuse or stalling tactic because she has someone else in the background.

Well, if I was a betting man, I would have to assume she’s still talking to the ex-boyfriend, because probably he tried to come back, but by then she was already kind of with you because you’re an older and more mature guy, hopefully. Now that she just disappeared like that, because you weren’t at the office anymore and she didn’t see you much anymore, maybe he showed up and they decided to work things out. Again, she had more time with that guy, so she was emotionally bonded with him and not with you. Maybe one of the reasons why she says she’s such a mess is because everything that turned her off about the ex is still there. So getting back together with them and hooking up with him again probably has not been a lot of fun for her. It’s just been full of the same chaos and drama that led to her breaking up with the guy the first time.

Maybe her ex or someone new, or she could genuinely be going through some mental stuff.

Again, you want to date somebody that’s normal and healthy, not a fruit loop, not somebody that’s going through a mental breakdown or having all kinds of mental health issues. You want her to get past the mental health issues. You want her to get all that stuff fixed and get to a normal, healthy, balanced place where she’s loving and enjoying her life. When somebody’s got serious mental health issues, that’s not somebody you should be going, “Oh, I can’t wait to jump in a relationship with her.” You should be going, “If she gets over it, she can reach out,” because it’s pretty rude for her to ghost you and she admits it as well. Again, once you find out all this stuff, you shouldn’t be going, “Oh, I can’t wait. I can’t wait to see her again.”

I really like this girl and usually I would have just moved on at the ghosting stage. What should I do in this case, Coach?

I would do nothing. You told her to get in touch. You told her to go work on herself, and what she did was pretty rude. The fact that she’s basically telling you that she’s a mess right now, this should not be something that should make you jump fences to be with her. This should make you have some pause and go, “You know, I’m going to see what else is out there. I want a girl that’s got her act together.” Once she gets her shit together, she’ll reach out. If she does reach out in the future, assume she wants to see you and make a date. You don’t chase after somebody who ghosts you. Simple as that. If you just let her be, maybe she would have gone through her grieving period, she would have got her mental health in order, then when she was ready, she would have reached back out.

You never try to keep somebody that doesn’t want to keep you, and you were trying to keep her. Probably you were shocked that she ghosted you. I mean, you should have been expecting that to happen because there was no time for her to heal at all. You have to assume there’s a good chance she went back to the other guy. That’s the only reason a woman, when things are going well, will completely disappear from your life and ghost you just like she did. If you start dating her again, and she’s still talking to the other guy and she hasn’t got her shit together yet, it’ll probably happen again. She’ll probably do the same shit and just all of a sudden disappear. You have to let women come to you at their pace. Like I said, all this stuff that she’s told you about herself, I wouldn’t be, “Oh, I can’t wait to get into a relationship with her.”

Thank you for your work, Coach. It has been so much help to me navigating the dating “war zone” as an mature guy, and I like the stuff you do with the girls too, who are women who really “get it.”

Best Wishes,

Bob

Well, the girls are getting better because they’ve all read 3% Man. Well, most of them have. Some of them have read Mastering Yourself. So far, Chunky’s read it. He’s been reading 3% Man since high school. Caroline’s got through it. Jade’s got through it. Erica has got through it. Jocelyne’s kind of started. Then as far as Mastering Yourself, so far Jade and Caroline have gotten through it. So Jade and Caroline are making Chunky look bad. He’s not pulling his weight. Maybe you guys can break his balls in the comments about that. Tell him he needs to step up, be a man, lead by example. He’s getting his ass kicked by two little girls. Chucky’s over six feet. Caroline is like five foot two. Jade’s like four foot eight. I mean, that’s why we call her the leader of the garden gnome people. It’s like, come on Chunky! The girls are kicking your ass!

So if you guys haven’t joined our Members Only content, as I was talking about, the girls are going through the books. One of the paid members only podcasts that we’re doing on a weekly basis is we have a 3% Man Study Group where we literally go page-by-page in the book. We answer the girls’ questions, they troll me a little bit, they go into detail on some of the things maybe they’ve learned or that they thought were profound. The idea is for it to be a teaching tool with myself, with Chunky. We’ve got James Lalino, who we just released an episode with this past week. He’s formerly of the Project Veritas fame. We had him on the podcast six, eight months ago I think it was, last year sometime. He’s going to be a regular contributor and coming probably once a month and filming with us.

You get the 3% Man podcast, you get the Mastering Yourself podcast, you get all the viewer question film days where we answer 10, or probably 12 to 15, viewer questions and any special videos that we do. Plus, I do six additional video coaching newsletters per week for Members Only. Obviously you get the email analysis on the website. If you’re watching this video on YouTube, underneath in the video description, there is a link so you can join Members Only on YouTube. There’s a link to join Members Only on Spotify. If you decide to join Members Only on our website, you get a 25% discount when you pay the whole year in advance. Plus, you get the email analysis. Again, right underneath the video, if you’re watching this on YouTube, it has the links and you can join on whatever platform you choose.

So, if you’ve got a question or a challenge and you’d like to get my help, go to UnderstandingRelationships.com, click the Products tab at the top of your screen and book a coaching session with yours truly. Until next time, I will talk to you soon.