Why Smothering & Over Pursuing Women Decreases Attraction, Interest & Respect

Why smothering & over pursuing women decreases attraction, interest & respect.

In this video coaching newsletter I discuss an email from a viewer who tends to obsess over women he is dating to the point that he smothers them and over pursues them right out of his life. He was dating a new woman after a recent breakup and he ignored the fact he was starting to do most of the pursuing until she started backing off, needing space and crying that her feelings were not growing for him. She tried to friend zone him, but he declined. He asks my opinion. My comments are in bold italics like this below in the body of his email.

Hi, I’m Coach Corey Wayne and this is my Video Coaching Newsletter. And the topic of today’s Newsletter is going to be, “Why Smothering & Over Pursuing Women Decreases Attraction, Interest & Respect.”

Well, this particular email is from a guy who he admits he’s always had a problem. He broke up with his previous ex-girlfriend, which what was ultimately what led him to my work. Because he was always obsessing over her. And so he’s been following me for about 4 to 5 months now. He’s been through 3% Man, about 4 or 5 times. And he said it helped him get over his ex-girlfriend. And he was just again, he was obsessing over her for years. So you can just imagine he’s acting needy. He’s acting neurotic. He’s probably constantly wanting to know where he stands with her.

And this is what happens when you don’t get enough strokes from Mom and Dad as a kid. In other words, you don’t hear “I love you” enough. You don’t get hugs. You don’t hear “I’m proud of you. I love you. I’m glad you’re my son.” You know, whatever happens to be. And so therefore you want love, but you never seem to get the love, attention and validation that you want. And so that’s how you operate in the world. And then you come across a girl you really like and who you really want to be with and who you really want love from.

But because you grew up in an environment where you, in essence, didn’t feel safe, you didn’t feel loved, you didn’t feel like it was stable, you’re unsure of yourself. You probably got yelled at a lot. I know, like I did. And so, in my case, we were largely ignored unless we were doing something wrong, and then we get the crap beat out of us. And so what happens is you want love from your parents, but you’re used to not getting it. So you already presuppose it’s not going to work out for you. You already presuppose that the girl, even though she might seem to care, you’re still not going to believe her.

You’re still going to doubt it, because you had so many decades of growing up in an environment where you never got any kind of reassurance. And the number one strength characteristic that women love in men is confidence. And so when you behave this way, when you act needy, when you pedestalize the girl, you constantly seek her attention and validation. You’re constantly unsure of where you stand. You’re always trying to find out where you stand with her. That’s the opposite of confidence. And so naturally, it’s going to repulse all women. And obviously that goes for gay and lesbian relationships as well.

If the masculine essence is needy, insecure, pedestalizes the feminine essence, the feminine essence is going to lose interest, attraction and respect. It’s the sexual polarities, the differences, that draw us to one another. And so with that in mind, now he’s seeing this girl for about two months. Things started off good, but same thing. He’s obsessing over her, obsessing where he stands and he doesn’t realize it, but within a couple of weeks, the power completely flips. He’s doing all the pursuing. And then as he notices that she’s lukewarm, she’s cold. She’s taking longer to reply to his messages. She’s becoming unavailable.

She’s not making herself available to see him because she’s got this going on, that going on, she feels smothered. Then she needs space, and it’s not until she’s backing away and tries to friend zone him that he realizes that he’s completely blown it. And most guys on some level kind of have had this kind of experience, especially when they meet a girl they really like. And if you look at what you see in traditional TV and movie shows, what you always see is the men obsessing over women, chasing after them, constantly seeking attention and validation. And the women are acting, very masculine and very stoic, very mysterious.

And of course it works in make believe world, but in the real world where we actually have to live, you actually end up repulsing women. But this is a good email to learn from, especially for guys that are relatively new, because this is what drives women away, because whether you realize it or not, when you’re constantly communicating, “I’m not worthy. I don’t deserve you. I’m not good enough for you. Eventually, when you find out what I’m really like, you’re not going to want me.”

And then the guy is always coming from that place, and eventually the woman is just gonna have to agree with you. She might intellectually know what a great guy you are. You look great on paper. You’re a nice person. “I don’t deserve you. You deserve someone so much better for you.” You hear those kinds of things. And in reality, you’ve just turned her off and dried her up. So a big part of overcoming this is learning to exercise self-control. This is why I say you got to read The Book 10 to 15 times.

You get to know it backwards and forwards. If you only read it 4 or 5 times, you’re going to learn a bunch of it. But it’s not enough to connect all the dots, especially if you’re needy, neurotic, you pedestalize women, you tend to smother them and chase them out of your life. It’s like this guy didn’t really recognize he was doing that until it was too late. He saw it, but he continued to bullshit himself into thinking everything was just fine and dandy.

Viewer Email:

Hey Coach, 

I want to say thank you for your work. I have been following you for 4-5 Months now and have read your book 4-5 times and subscribed on YT to be able to get more info as well. It helped me to get over my ex girlfriend who I obsessed over for years. 

Yeah. Obsessing over your girl is not a masculine thing. This is what happens when Mom and Dad don’t give you enough strokes. They don’t reassure you enough. They don’t fill your bucket of self-esteem high enough because there’s so many holes in it that they actually end up making that it’s constantly running dry. So you’re kind of always in a deficit, or at least you feel like you’re always in a deficit.

I put your work into practice soon after and began focusing on myself while just looking to hang out, have fun, and hook up. I became so successful with it that I began dating 5 girls at once.

And so this is why he probably stopped reading The Book and didn’t take me seriously when I said, you got to read it 10 to 15 times and you got to read it 10 to 15 times, because when you come across the girl you really like and you really want to be with, that’s when it gets really hard. When you got five different girls that are into you, it’s pretty easy to have confidence and swagger. You’re not in a fearful state.

You don’t really worry about losing a girl because you got five total that are into you. But as he starts to obsess over one, the ones he’s not that into kind of fall by the wayside. And then he’s only focused on the one he obsesses over. And so his behavior starts to change. He goes from being confident and mysterious and letting her pursue him to him, pursuing her because he fears losing her. He literally chases her out of his life.

And used the time to see which of them I liked most because I personally don’t like having to balance and remember what conversations I’ve had with each of them.

It is a lot of work dating that many women at one time.

After figuring out which one I liked and fit with the best, I started giving her more time and letting the other girls go one by one. 

We continued to just hang out, have fun, and hook up every time we were together.

Well, if you’re dating five different women and then you zero in on this one that you like, what should happen is that you stop spending time with the others and you start spending more with this one. But it has to be her idea. You have to let her come to you at her pace and the way The Book is set up and designed is to create the conditions where women will do most, if not all, the calling, texting and pursuing eventually. It doesn’t start out right away, but we have to start the courtship off. We have to pursue in the beginning.

But once a woman becomes emotionally engaged, she starts to care. She likes you. It’s a scientific fact that women are more attracted to men whose feelings are unclear. She’ll work harder to spend more time with you and get your attention, because that’s feminine energy. Women naturally, innately do this on their own without any kind of prodding. Again, it’s something, this is the way the creator has set things up. So if you don’t like it, you can complain to the big man upstairs. I’m just the messenger.

However you violate those principles, you start seeking her attention and validation. And what’s happening is you’re acting like a girl. And at that point, you’re acting like the feminine essence and two feminine essences are going to repulse one another. She can go from thinking, you’re a great guy, being really into you, really feeling attracted to you, wanting to be with you. And then as the power flips and as these other girls he was seeing started to fall by the wayside, he started smothering her because again, he’s worried of losing her, because once he started to care, now he has real downside risk.

Meaning what if she doesn’t love him anymore? What if she leaves like all the others? What if she shows low interest like all the others? And us guys were driven to take action? Then we fall under “The Illusion Of Action”, feeling like we have to do something to make her like us more, instead of just focusing on our mission and purpose and being content. If you got enough hugs and I love yous from Mom and Dad, when you’re not hearing from the girl and you’re not talking to her and you’re not seeing her, you actually enjoy that.

You enjoy your time alone. You enjoy your time apart. You can catch up with your friends. You can spend time in your man cave. You can work on your hobbies, your interests. See your family, all the things that are important to you. But what starts to happen is that he needs her attention and validation in order to feel good about himself, because again, he was starved for affection and attention as a kid.

And then he grows up and he behaves the same way that his parents, in essence, trained him to behave just like mine, trained me to behave that way. But once you start to recognize how your childhood upbringing affects you and you understand what works and what doesn’t work, then over time you can start to implement what’s in The Book. And if you know The Book backwards and forwards, it’s much easier to let women come to you at their pace because they naturally do it anyways.

Over time though, I noticed that I was the one reaching out to her to set up the date for the next week (This was a mistake).

Yeah, it’s something that typically happens very slowly. You got to pay attention to her effort. As The Book says, you should never do more than 20 to 30% of the calling, texting, pursuing, and contact initiation. And really, you only have to do that for the first few weeks or month or so if you’re dealing with a normal, healthy woman. Because after 3 to 4 weeks of dating, usually you’re sleeping together at that point. And then what happens is she’s calling you or texting you or messaging you once or twice a week.

And if she’s doing that, then you just wait to hear from her and set the next date. And then what happens as the weeks go by, and especially you get in week six, seven, eight, you’re usually going to be together just about every day, every evening you’re either staying at her place or she’s staying at yours. It’s just a natural progression. The more her interest goes up, the more she wants to be with you.

But if you’re chasing and you’re pursuing too much, and you never slowly start to back off and let her come to you, what ends up happening like this guy did, he was only focused on his attraction and his interest in her, and he completely ignored the fact that she wasn’t as into him as he was into her. Because he was driven by his fears.

One night about two months in, I went over to her place to have a good time the night before we went to a baseball game and right when I walked in the door, I was greeted by her dog. She started crying out of the blue, and asked if we could go to her room to talk. She explained to me that she thinks I’m a really amazing guy and gentleman.

You’re such a great guy. You’re such a gentleman. You’re so nice.

Fun and have a great connection but doesn’t understand why she doesn’t get the feeling or need to reach out to me.

I assume he probably brought that up, maybe. But the fact that she’s saying that because women don’t understand how attraction works, they never really think about it. They have a logical explanation. But when they’re actually dating somebody they care about, they’re driven by their emotions and their feelings and they don’t understand. So she’s looking at this going, “Man, this really is a great guy. He’s a total gentleman. He treats me good. But yet my feelings are not the same as his for me.” And women don’t understand that. They feel kind of guilty. “They think, what’s wrong with me?”

And what’s really wrong is that he’s acting unattractive. He’s acting like a needy, insecure little boy. Or a little girl for that matter, instead of a man who’s stoic, who’s mysterious, who’s kind of hard to figure out a little bit. In other words, she has to get his attention, but he’s happy to hear from her when she reaches out. But he never really gives her the space to miss him. Because again, he’s focused on his interest in her, and he’s worried that she’s going to dip like all the others did, like the ex-girlfriend who he obsessed over.

If I was to talk to his ex-girlfriend, or anybody else he dated in the past. He probably treated them all the same way. He cares about the girl, puts her on a pedestal, kisses her ass. He’s too nice. He calls too much. He texts too much. He’s smothering. The women want space. He probably doesn’t give them space. And he continues pursuing until he either gets ghosted or friend zoned or dumped.

I should have realized I needed to back off right here. We later performed the Indoor Olympics that night and the next morning before going to the baseball game. Now the following day (Monday), I ran into her at my gym which was random because we usually workout in different areas and had a brief conversation. I left and came back to the gym because I forgot a personal item and she was walking to her car. Went to give her a kiss goodbye and got the dreaded side cheek.

It just shows he’s totally focused on how much he likes her. He’s constantly pursuing, constantly seeking attention. He’s treating her like his mommy, like he needs an attaboy from mommy. It’s very unattractive.

She was supposed to come watch one of my matches on Wednesday because I am a Pro athlete. she messaged me that day saying that she had a Doctors appointment and was going to get dinner with her Aunt and couldn’t make it (which told me that she was starting to have a lower interest. 

Well, she’s basically breaking a date with you there because she doesn’t want to be around you because she feels guilty. She knows you’re a great guy, but instead of her becoming more interested in you, she’s becoming less. And you’re not noticing it because you’re totally focused on how much you like her and trying to force and shoehorn yourself into her life, instead of letting her come to you at her pace.

Friday came along and I had posted a video on Snapchat and she asked if I was going to an event that she already knew I was going to, I got free tickets so I asked if she wanted to come and she declined as she was flying out for a day trip with her best friend early the next morning.

I would have just said, “Hey, no problem, call me when you get back.” But does he do that? No. He continues obsessing and pedestalizing and chasing and trying to force himself into her life. Because again, he’s treating her like his Mommy.

I decided to call her Sunday.

She just canceled a date on you, and then you’re already trying to make another date.

I decided to call her Sunday to try and plan the next date and she returned my call later that night.

Should have been a clue that she’s backing off. The best thing when a woman is backing off is to match and mirror that. That’s right out of The Book. But he only read it 4 or 5 times. As soon as he started getting laid a bunch with those other girls, he was like, “I got it. I’m a Jedi Master now. I don’t need to read Corey’s book 10 to 15 times. I don’t know what he’s talking about. That’s ridiculous. Who reads a book 10 to 15 times?” And yet, here we are. You didn’t follow instructions this is why. I’ve been doing this for 20 years.

Over the phone she started crying significantly again.

Because she feels guilty. She knows you’re a great dude, but your game sucks and it’s sloppy and you act needy. I mean, this is all laid out in The Book, but you didn’t want to take the time. You focused on the Pickup Skills and Dating Skills and Seduction Skills and didn’t care about anything else.

And began telling me that she does not want to waste my time and that she doesn’t know if she is going to be living in the same state next year due to her job etc.

All she knows is that she’s not that into it. She’s not feeling it.

So I worked to calm her down over the phone and explained that I did Like her a lot.

Dude, she knows you like her a lot. You don’t need to vomit your feelings to her. This girl is trying to get away from you, and you’re thinking that if you just tell her how much you like her. This is what you see in the movies all the time. And if you talk to all your female friends, this is what they’ll tell you. “Oh, just tell her how much you care and how much you love her and want to be with her and and how important she is to you.” Because that’s what it says in the movies. And so he does that. But it’s going to have zero effect. It has zero effect on how she feels about you.

And it sucks to hear this but I understand if she needs space for a little bit. We discussed following up the next Sunday. As much as I want to see her or talk to her I am refraining from it as I understand giving her the space and letting her come back like a cat would be the best scenario here.

Yeah, but the damage has been done, Dude. It’s like this has been coming for weeks, and you kept ignoring it until she’s basically bawling on the phone because she feels guilty that she doesn’t like you more. She knows she should, but she doesn’t understand it. Because, again, most women don’t understand how attraction works. All she knows is that her interest is low and she’s not feeling the same way that you are.

Even if Sunday comes around and I do not hear from her, I am not going to reach out, as I understand she needs to be the one to reach out to me.

We were supposed to go to a wedding in the coming weeks and I need to let the Bride and Groom know if she is still coming or not soon. Should I just forget about the wedding and all that? 

Well, I wouldn’t do anything. I’d still go to the wedding that you’re supposed to go to. I would just let the girl be. When a woman’s asking you for space, the worst thing you can do is keep chasing her and smothering her. So about a week or so later, he sends an update to that first email.

Update on the situation.

She ended up calling me a few days after our discussed time and said that she wanted to apologize for not calling on Sunday like we spoke about.

Yeah, because the reason she didn’t call on Sunday is her feelings hadn’t really changed. That’s why.

I told her it was okay as I didn’t want to force the conversation earlier than needed. She then told me that she would like to just stay friends.

So we got friend zoned.

And after learning from reading the book and watching your videos, I told her I think she is an amazing person and has been super fun to be with, but that it’s unfortunate and I won’t just be friends with her because I am only looking for a relationship between the two of us and if we just stayed friends, I would always have continued to only be trying to for a relationship. 

She than asked if we can still be cordial if we see each other around as we met through a mutual friend and go to the same gym, I told her of course. I would never be an asshole for no reason. I then ended the conversation telling her to reach out if she ever changes her mind. With all this being said, this was something difficult for me to do as it’s not something I’ve ever done before. 

Well it should have happened a lot earlier, when you noticed that she wasn’t excited to see you, the quickest way to get somebody else’s attention is to remove yours. And if you notice that she’s not as excited, then just give her the gift of missing you and just hang back and wait to hear from her when she starts to go cold. If you message her about setting a date and she waits a whole day or 24 hours to respond. That’s not a good sign. It doesn’t mean you put the hammer down and call and text and pursue more. It means you need to back off because she doesn’t really value you that much.

My question is, because we have a mutual friend and we do run into an each other from time to time, how do you stay in No Contact effectively for them to come back and miss you regardless of time? 

Well, you don’t go out of your way to see her. Say she’s in the gym, don’t go up and talk to her. Let her come to you. If you make eye contact, smile and wave to her. Then go about finishing the set that you’re on. Don’t go up to her. Don’t pursue in any way. How would you treat her if you were tired of fucking her? You’d be nice. You’d be cordial and polite. But other than that, you would be going about your business because you don’t want to give her the impression that you might want to rekindle things because she’s hung up on you and you don’t want to lead her on. That’s how you would be treating her.

Another question I would like to know is if it is normal for a girl to seem a little irritated that you refuse to just be friends and what does that mean if they are mad about it?

Thank you and your work has helped a ton.

Bob

Well, what is behind anger? Fear. Always fear. Fear that we’re not enough. Fear that we won’t be loved. So I would say on some level she’s thinking, “Oh, I’ll put him in the friend zone. And then that way, if my feelings ever change, I can just say, Hey, let’s go out on a date again. And then we just pick right back up where we left off.” So this is forcing her to shit or get off the pot. She’s getting to experience life without you.

Because you wanted sex and romance. She said, “How about friendship and some blue balls for you?” And you said, “Nah, I don’t think so.” And so she got big mad. Hey, who cares? You’re interested in sex and romance. You’re not interested in something platonic. And so if she’s mad, it’s like, who cares? She friend zoned you. And so from this point forward, you should be following what’s in 7 Principles To Get An Ex Back. And that means you let her do 100% of the calling, texting and pursuing. So say she reaches out in a few weeks. “Hey, how are you? How you been? I’ve been thinking…”

Something like that. Then you just say, “Hey, well, why don’t we get together and make dinner at my place. And then invite her over, hang out, have fun, hook up. But you got to let her do 100% of the calling, texting and pursuing from here on out. Even if she comes back, even if she starts coming over, if she comes over three dates in a row and you hook up all three times, you got to let her initiate all of it. Because in that way, she’ll do it at her pace. And plus, she’s the one that unilaterally ended things.

She tried to friend zone you when you were fucking and dating, and you weren’t interested in just friendship and blue balls. So you said, I’ll see you later. Why? Because the strongest negotiating position is being able to walk away and mean it. And so where you really went wrong is you didn’t really understand and you didn’t act consistent with the Thích Nhất Hạnh quote. “You must love in such a way that the person you love feels free.” And you didn’t do that. You kept smothering her. You kept moving forward. You only focused on your feelings about her.

You projected your high interest, and you ignored her declining interest until you couldn’t ignore it any longer because she rejected you and stuck you in friend zone. But at the very least, at the very end there you backed off and said, “Well, I’m not interested in this. Call me if you change your mind.” So again, if you ever see her out or you hear about her. “Hey, what happened to you and so-and-so? Oh, we dated for a few weeks or we dated for a month or so. It was a lot of fun. It was like. So it was like, I don’t know. We’ll see.” Then change the subject.

Don’t go. “Oh, it’s so hard. I’m so brokenhearted, I miss her.” Don’t be saying that because that’ll get back to her. So, hey, what happened with you and so-and-so? It was like, yeah, we’re dating for about a month or so. It was like we had a lot of fun together. So what’s going on? I was like, I don’t know. She needed a little space. She was going through a hard time or whatever. It’s, I don’t know. Shit. I met her when I was dating four other girls, so I got several girls I’m dating now. It’s like, hey, may the best girl win. I want a girl who really wants to be with me.

And so what, are you going to date her again in the future? It’s like, I don’t know if I hear from her. Maybe we’ll see. So how about them Yankees? They just changed the subject. Change it into something else. Don’t keep talking about the same thing. Less really is more in this particular instance. You got to read The Book and you got to apply it. You can’t selectively cherry pick and ignore the things that are uncomfortable. But at least as he said, this is the first time you ever walked away and said no thanks to friendship because he’s been experiencing that his whole life.

If you keep doing what you’ve always done, you’ll continue to get what you’ve always got. And obviously he wasn’t happy with the results. I wasn’t either when these kinds of things were happening to me. And so that’s why you got to change your approach. Because your approach is not working. It’s not attractive.

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