Why You Should Never Give Liars & Cheaters A 2nd Chance

Why you should never give liars and cheaters a 2nd chance at romance with you.

In this video coaching newsletter, I discuss a follow-up email from a viewer whose previous email I answered in the video, “When To Dump Women Who Violate Your Boundaries,” and he gives us an update on what’s happened since. He had broken things off, because she was constantly lying and deceiving him about her male orbiters and her constant attention and validation seeking from other men while they were dating. Unfortunately, he gave her another chance, and it turns out she was having an affair with a married guy from the office off and on behind his back and lying about it.

This email shows the consequences of failing to enforce healthy boundaries and break it off permanently with women who have proven to be habitually dishonest and disloyal. My comments are in bold italics like this below in the body of his email.

In my opinion, he mistakenly gave her another chance, because her behavior was pretty egregious in the past. And it’s one thing to set and enforce healthy boundaries, but if you’re dealing with somebody that has no integrity and they’re repeatedly doing the same thing over and over, the number one most important thing to us guys in a relationship is loyalty. And in this particular case, this woman was constantly demonstrating that she was not a loyal person and incapable of it, over and over and over and over again. And so, when you give somebody like that another chance, of course, they’re going to violate it.

And part of this guy’s email was like, “Is it too late for me? I’m 40 years old.” So he’s like, “My life is half over. It’s too late for me.” And so, because of this story that he’s developed now, “I’m too old,” he’s willing to put up a crap like this, which predictably ends in dishonesty, disloyalty, and obviously cheating. Because apparently, this woman was carrying on an affair, when they got back the second time, with a guy who was married and was cheating on his wife with her.

He supposedly left his wife and then he went back to his wife. And so, he ended up rejecting this particular girl. And it’s obvious she was still carrying the torch, because rejection breeds obsession. And then this guy finally realized what was going on, and obviously, it ended the same way. Maya Angelou said, “When somebody tells you or shows you who they are, believe them the first time.”

And so, if you guys go back and look at that original video newsletter, “When To Dump Women Who Violate Your Boundaries,” it was pretty obvious it was a constant violation of the boundaries. Because character is destiny, and this woman didn’t have any character. She doesn’t value loyalty in her mind. She just lies her way out of everything. If she wants attention from other guys, even though she’s in a relationship, she’s going to go and get it. She doesn’t see anything wrong with it, and her behavior did not modify in the least bit.

So, this is kind of like the scorpion in the frog analogy, where this guy is the frog and now he’s gotten stung. And as they’re sinking below the water, because he’s paralyzed, the frog is going to drown and so is the scorpion. But the scorpion is like, “Hey, this is what I do.” And in this particular case, this particular woman, she’s a liar and a cheater. She’s like, “Hey, this is what I do.” So, you’ve got to be strong enough and man enough to walk away from that permanently and never look back.

You don’t give somebody like this a second chance because you’re just giving them an opportunity to burn you again. And on top of that, you’re enabling their behavior. You’re communicating that it’s okay. And because most guys are thirsty, they’ll put up with this behavior, and that’s why women like this just constantly monkey branch from one due to the next. And they’re not loyal to anybody, because there’s always a steady stream of guys that are happy to be at the front of the line to get walked all over, because the thirst is real.

Viewer’s Email:

Hey Corey,

I wrote to you in the past and you published my story in, “When To Dump Women Who Violate Your Boundaries.” Thank you again. 

Obviously, you didn’t listen.

A couple months after this ended, I ran into an old flame. We had a great relationship, but I was fresh out of divorce and she had some issues of her own. We called it off and ended up meeting up again when her mom noticed I was single. I had updated you on this at one point. Everything was really great for months and I was sticking to the advice I’ve learned from you. Seems to be a theme of “everything was great for months.”

Well, you can’t make good wine from bad grapes. And if you give a girl another chance after she’s burned you, and then you get burned again, well, that’s on you.

When we initially got together, she was very adamant that she was single.

“No, really, truly, I am single now.” She’s going out of her way to convince him, because she’s not even convinced herself.

I asked because we hadn’t spoken in 8 months and I didn’t want to involve myself in anything messy.

Well, it was obviously pretty messy the first time they were involved together.

She asked the same and was very insistent that this was exclusive. A few weeks later, after several amazing weekends where she was doing 110% of the pursuing, she texted me…

There’s no such thing as 110% pursuing. She either does 100% of it, or she doesn’t.

…saying that she had to be honest.

Oh, now she’s going to be honest. Now, after she’s reeled you back in, “Oh, by the way, something I forgot to tell you. Whoops! It’s just a little thing. A little white lie, on top of the thousand other white lies I told you in the past.”

That there was a flirty work relationship that she had to put to bed. This was creating issues at work. No big deal. I told her to handle whatever she needed to and give me a shout when she figures out what she would like to do. Several days later, I got a text saying that her mind was “crystal clear” and I was the one she wanted.

He dumped her before because of this behavior, and now it’s continuing. “You’re the only one I want. Oh, by the way, there’s this flirty relationship, guy thing at work. Sorry, I let that out. Whoops!”

That she should have never let me go and I was the “one.”

Oh, boy. I’ll bet.

During this time, she was really defensive about some stuff I posted.

Remember, liars and cheaters tend to always be accusatory to other people being liars and cheaters, because they’re projecting. So, this is a tell that you’re with a woman who is dishonest, and disloyal, and is lying and cheating on you when she often gets incredibly jealous about other women and accuses you of doing something that you shouldn’t have been doing, when you know you’ve been a good guy. So, when that happens, you’re dating a girl and she becomes that way, the hairs on the back of your neck should stand up. You should be like, “Ooh, my Spidey senses are tingling, and that’s not good.”

A picture in particular with some friends of mine. She asked me to pull it down because it looked like I was involved with one of the girls. I saw her point and pulled the photo. This will become important later on, as her manipulating.

Like, you didn’t figure out the first time around she was a manipulator?

Or, maybe being guilty.

Well, I would agree with that, too.

Whichever way you want to see it.

Whichever way you want to see it. She’s a liar and she’s a cheater, she’s guilty, obviously, and she’s projecting.

The next few months were wonderful. Zero indication of anything wrong. Over the past two weeks I noticed her mentioning a guy’s name a lot.

Yeah, that’s not good. This was the same behavior. Remember, in the past, he had broken up with her because constant male orbiters. “Everything is great,” and now, all of a sudden, she’s talking about some dude at work a lot. So what does that tell you? She hasn’t changed. People don’t change. They may become a better version of who they are, but they don’t change. This woman, all she’s going to do is become a better liar as she gets older and become more clever at hiding it.

I didn’t let on that it bothered me and did some digging. Over the past weekend, she came home late on Friday and referred to the guy again as her “work friend”…

“He’s just a work friend. You don’t have to worry about him.”

…and asked me if it bothered me. I told her no.

Yeah, I probably wouldn’t have said that. Again, this is kind of like you’re putting the blinders on and just pretending like it’s not happening, even though this is what led to you breaking it off the first time with her.

The following day, we attended her work Christmas party. I knew who the guy was at this point. When we entered the room, he immediately started whispering with her receptionist and left. The alarm bells really started going on. I did something I probably shouldn’t have and went through her phone while she was asleep.

Sherlock Holmes to the rescue. Sherlock phones to the rescue.

What I found was it was much more than a flirty work relationship.

No way! That can’t be! I’m shocked, I tell you. You ever see “Casablanca?” There is a scene where the guy is like, “I’m shocked, shocked, I tell you!”

Going back to when we started being exclusive, she was texting her friends talking about how heartbroken she was over him not wanting her. She was still messaging him romantic things when we were exclusive.

I just can’t believe it. I’m shocked. You mean, the woman from the previous email with all the male orbiters and the constant inviting attention from other dudes? It’s still going on, even though you’re exclusive? Oh, this is so shocking.

Inviting him over and saying very similar things to him as she was to me.

Well, hey, the lines work. Might as well reuse them.

This was super hurtful. Apparently, the guy left his wife, they got together, he dumped her and went back to his wife, then the guy and his wife broke up again about the time she started mentioning his name. 

So, he becomes available, and he starts messaging her. So, liars and cheaters – he lied and cheated to his wife, she lied and cheated to you. And now that he’s available… this hoe ain’t loyal to nobody.

Long story short, I confronted her and ended the relationship. She continued to lie…

Oh, I can’t believe it. She’s still lying, huh?

…insisting it was just a flirty work thing.

Oh, yeah. It’s just a flirty work thing. Sure.

And she had never even kissed him.

Oh, sure. Totally believable. Yep. Sure. Totally.

From how upset she was and how she continued to pursue him while with me, I knew that was a lie. I couldn’t get past the lies and manipulation.

Well, you should have never given her a second chance, and this is why. Because she did the same thing, and you enabled her behavior. Reinforcing to her that there’s no consequences. Besides, she’ll just bounce back to him. There’s no consequences, because he’s willing to cheat. And now, they can cheat on each other. There’s a 95% chance that the the two of them will cheat on each other at some point. That’s just how they roll. That’s the karma. It’s a nice karmic loop that you should permanently remove yourself from.

Also, I couldn’t get past her saying similar things to both of us.

Again, as I was saying those are good lines, and they obviously worked. You know, it’s like the ones pickup artists use. But hey, the lines work. You know, the stuff I say in my book, guys still use it, word for word, “Hey, I think you need to get it over with and come over here and kiss me.” I’ve gotten thousands of emails over the years from guys who use that same line, and not once has a girl gone, “That’s out of Corey Wayne’s book. That’s a line!” It works, might as well use it. Can’t fault the girl for her game. She’s got one liners that work. Why not? Got to recycle them. Because to each guy, it’s a completely new thing.

The way I looked at it was, she didn’t choose me, she was out of options and settled for me.

Well, that’s the way a loser would think. You should take it as a compliment when a woman wants you and desires you. Besides, at the end of the day, you acted like a chump anyway. She knew she could walk all over you and you’d take her back, which you obviously did. So, you deserved it. You threw yourself on the ground and said, “Oh, please use me as a doormat, your highness. Just go ahead and wipe those feet on my brand new white jacket. It’s fine, I love you. You’re the one for me.”

The night she was making me feel guilty about posting photos, she was texting him to come over.

Remember what I said earlier about projection? She’s upset about the photos because she’s a liar and a cheater. No one will ever do or say anything to you that isn’t a direct reflection of how they feel about themselves in a moment. And the other one that goes with that, no one will ever do or say anything to you that you don’t invite them to do. Both of them apply in this case. He invited her to do it again and again and again and again. And then she did it again, and he’s like, “I can’t believe it. I could have had V-8!”

Had this guy actually responded to her inviting him over, we wouldn’t have been together.

This is as predictable as the sun coming up in East and setting in the West, dude. You thought you’d be different.

I explained that our relationship was built on a lie, and I could no longer trust her along with all the other reasons. Her family begged me to reconsider and told me I was being too harsh. I just couldn’t.

Yeah, because her family’s a bunch of ratchet trailer trash anyway. That’s who taught her how to be this way, so of course they’re going to see nothing wrong with it. Of course they’re going to think that you’re being harsh, because they’re all like that.

I still wonder if I did the right thing.

Come on, man. Seriously, dude, have some self respect. That’s pathetic. I can’t believe you even wrote that after all this.

I feel I did, but you know how your mind can play games. At 40, I just feel I cannot risk anything since my life is literally more than half over.

Well, stop wasting your time trying to turn a hoe into a housewife. It’s not going to happen. I told you that the last time. You didn’t believe me, and you did it again. And now you’re still going, “I wonder if I did the right thing, Coach.” Some guys just deserve what they get. They literally do it to themselves over and over and over again.

I’ve been divorced and spent 10 years in a bad marriage because of similar issues.

Your problem is that you keep hanging out with low quality women, thinking you’re going to change them, or save them, or fix them, or be Captain Save-a-Hoe. So, you wasted ten years with the ex, and then you wasted the better part of a year with this ratchet, a year, year and a half, however long it was that you guys both saw each other. I mean, you can ignore reality, but you can’t ignore the consequences of ignoring reality, which you are now stinging from.

It sucks, I feel for you, but you’ve got to dip on women when you notice this behavior. You don’t just stick around and waste months of your life. And so, the reason why you feel like 40 is too late for you is because you’re wasting your time with low quality, trailer trash women. Simple as that. This is a hookup girl. This is a party girl. This is a girl you hook up with, you bang a few times. You’re like, “My dry spell is over,” and then you move on to the next. You don’t sit around and try to turn a hoe into a housewife, thinking you’re going to save or fix her. That’s absurd.

Things really feel hopeless dating wise, as this is all I hear about and have encountered myself. I would be interested to hear your opinion on all of it. 

Thank you, 

Bob

Again, your problem is that you’re not disengaging from low quality people, and so you wasted over ten years of your life with two low quality women. I’d guess about 12-13 years that you wasted of your life with two women that you should have dipped on within a few weeks of meeting them, because you didn’t pre-screen them properly. You’ve got to see reality as it is not better than it is.

If I were you, I’d be following what’s in the book. Read it 10 to 15 times and actually apply it, because you’re you’re trying to fix somebody that’s just simply not fixable. And so, your pattern is to make excuses for girls that you think you’re going to save. You’re looking for integrity, easygoing, easy to get along with. Does she keep her word?

I mean, when a chick’s got dozens of male orbiters, and a thirst trap Instagram, and is constantly seeking attention and validation from other men, constantly posting pictures, and then you think you’re going to make that into a respectable wife, it’s like, no. Girls with daddy issues like that, very rarely are they anything more than somebody to have a fun hookup with.

And quite frankly, in society, we need those girls. Those are the girls you lose your virginity to. Those are the girls that after you’ve had a breakup, you meet and you hook up for a few times. You just don’t stick around. You don’t try to be in a relationship with those type of girls. They’re definitely needed in society, because they help a lot of guys blow their barrels out. But you don’t want to wife up a cum dumpster. I mean, sorry. It is what it is.

So, if you’ve got a question or a challenge and you’d like to get my help, go to UnderstandingRelationships.com, click the Products tab at the top of your screen and book a coaching session with yours truly.